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F1 Perspectives

Talk about the Teams & Drivers

Moderators: Lyria, Mafia, Lawrence, Administrator

Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Wed Dec 16, 2015 4:44 pm

Noted - GP247
But Marchionne said: “They wanted these power units. It was (Max) Mosley’s idea and he was right — the future of the auto industry is hybrid.”

Having rejected the ‘parallel’ rules proposal, the manufacturers have now been tasked with coming up with a new, cheaper and more competitive engine formula.

But Marchionne said: “It is simply not true that this is not possible with the current engines. We need to find compromises.

“If Formula 1 becomes a kind of single seater version of Nascar, then Ferrari is not interested.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Lawrence on Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:08 pm

Actually, I thought this was pretty significant:

Ferrari have written to the FIA expressing their view that it has no right to grant Ecclestone and Todt this power and that the rule-making procedure must be followed.

Marchionne said: "It's a choice that we obviously do not share, because we believe that the development of the regulations should be done in a coordinated manner.


I assume that if they sent a letter to FIA, it has been carefully vetted by their lawyers....and so forth. So, Ecclestone and Todt are setting themselves up for a major lawsuit.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Lawrence on Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:11 pm

Oh and.....

Marchionne also described Ecclestone's frequent proposals to return to the V8 naturally aspirated engines used until 2013 as "an insult".

He said: "The climate summit in Paris has shown all of us where the path leads. We cannot ignore a technology that is relevant to production vehicles.

"In five to 10 years, the majority of all vehicles will be equipped on the road with hybrid technology."
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Mach on Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:39 pm

Lawrence wrote:Oh and.....

Marchionne also described Ecclestone's frequent proposals to return to the V8 naturally aspirated engines used until 2013 as "an insult".

He said: "The climate summit in Paris has shown all of us where the path leads. We cannot ignore a technology that is relevant to production vehicles.

"In five to 10 years, the majority of all vehicles will be equipped on the road with hybrid technology."

I wonder what the Paris Summit folks think about F1 circus flying around 20 cars...drivers...equipment etc to 21 circuits world wide?
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Thu Dec 17, 2015 5:58 pm

Hybrids is merely a transitional technology to something else; we just do not know what that something else is, and we should not assume an electric car is the answer. (Energy has to come from somewhere, and has to be made available to all users everywhere on demand). Maybe future is a hydrogen car, maybe combination of electric and something else, maybe it is public transport. In Tokyo for example I've never thought that I need a car, loving public transportation without V8 (something I had for more than 10 years) or electric (something I never had nor miss).
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Lawrence on Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:51 pm

Mach wrote:I wonder what the Paris Summit folks think about F1 circus flying around 20 cars...drivers...equipment etc to 21 circuits world wide?


I don't think it is about whether Formula one is ecologically sound...but whether it is actually relevant to the modern world. I have always felt that Bernie's engine proposals were a move back to a world that is disappearing.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Mach on Fri Dec 18, 2015 5:11 pm

Lawrence wrote:
Mach wrote:I wonder what the Paris Summit folks think about F1 circus flying around 20 cars...drivers...equipment etc to 21 circuits world wide?


I don't think it is about whether Formula one is ecologically sound...but whether it is actually relevant to the modern world. I have always felt that Bernie's engine proposals were a move back to a world that is disappearing.
Generally speaking, people prefer to be entertained regardless if they learn anything or understand the consequences of how entertainment is delivered.

F1 fans want very loud engines. Whether its petrol or electronic is irrelevant.

Bernie knows F1 must be sexy, loud and fast!!!

The majority of fans know little about the detailed technology of the current power units.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:21 pm

Forbes - teams as money bags

Ferrari USD 1.35 BILL
Mercedes USD 675MM
McHonda USD 650MM
RBR USD 625MM


Manor USD 65MM
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Lawrence on Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:56 am

Are you sure about these figures? Ferrari was spending twice what everyone else was in 2015? I gather the Williams budget was around $200 million (it is public knowledge).
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:01 am

I couldn't cross-ref. url-link was blocked, but those figures were quoted not as budget, but as team-values, or min. asking prices if you wish to purchase a respective team, assuming it is on sale.

Will. was at USD400MM.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Sat Dec 19, 2015 9:26 am

How is that for logic and competitive spirit? More you are successful in competitive series, more severely FiA/FOM will punish you.

motorsport.com; Quote - Mercedes boss Toto

Wolff says his team has been left with a bitter-sweet feeling after having to
pay a record $4.8 million entry fee for the 2016 Formula 1 championship.


In contrast, Manor will pay about 1/2 MM.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Sat Dec 19, 2015 11:48 am

Declining interest? Meanwhile, should I have believed (mostly British) internet media publications, it was all F1 realted sing and song on the island, in contrast to German TV figures.

Now this:
British newspapers this week said the BBC has now decided to stop broadcasting F1 with immediate effect due to cost cuts, despite an ongoing contract.
En savoir plus sur http://www.thisisf1.com/2015/12/19/bbc- ... xSiTFsr.99




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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Lawrence on Sat Dec 19, 2015 11:25 pm

Sakae wrote:I couldn't cross-ref. url-link was blocked, but those figures were quoted not as budget, but as team-values, or min. asking prices if you wish to purchase a respective team, assuming it is on sale.

Will. was at USD400MM.


Yea, team value is not budget. Certainly Ferrari would be the highest, because of its legacy.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Sakae on Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:13 am

Interesting and somewhat fighting talk in this:
http://www.grandprix247.com/2015/12/22/ecclestone-mercedes-and-ferrari-joined-at-the-hip-like-siamese-twins/

In a political arena this is called (I think) letting out baloons with aim to calibrate various responses in advance of the real thing. Accusing indirectly Ferrari and Mercedes from collaborating (conspiring?) with aim to manipulate F1 regulatory agrements is IMHO a serious one.

Jan 15 cannot come soon enough, a date when teams are suppose to reveal their cost saving proposals. I am surprised however over jest of the claim, that 2 teams, having 2 voices out of 18 in total are solely responsible for current situation. Well, maybe not surprised by sheer audacity of it, but that others let FOM away with this rhetoric.
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Re: F1 Perspectives

Postby Mach on Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:32 pm

Sakae wrote:Interesting and somewhat fighting talk in this:
http://www.grandprix247.com/2015/12/22/ecclestone-mercedes-and-ferrari-joined-at-the-hip-like-siamese-twins/

In a political arena this is called (I think) letting out baloons with aim to calibrate various responses in advance of the real thing. Accusing indirectly Ferrari and Mercedes from collaborating (conspiring?) with aim to manipulate F1 regulatory agrements is IMHO a serious one.

Jan 15 cannot come soon enough, a date when teams are suppose to reveal their cost saving proposals. I am surprised however over jest of the claim, that 2 teams, having 2 voices out of 18 in total are solely responsible for current situation. Well, maybe not surprised by sheer audacity of it, but that others let FOM away with this rhetoric.
I expect Ferrari, Mercedes, Honda and Renault to share the same obvious view point to protect their interests as engine manufacturers. None of the aforementioned teams will race with a Cosworth spec engine.
Rest assured, the conflict isn't Ferrari & Mercedes versus FIA or FOM for that matter. The conflict is Big budget teams commercial gains Vs Little budget teams commercial gains :tophat:
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